Sunday, February 6, 2011

Thirty-Three Retired Bishops

Recently 33 retired United Methodist Bishops issued a statement that calls the church to reconsider Paragraph 304.3 from The Book of Discipline (2008)

“…the practice of homosexuality is incompatible with Christian teaching. Therefore self-avowed practicing homosexuals are not to be certified as candidates, ordained as ministers, or appointed to serve in The United Methodist Church.”

In the statement they raise a number of issues such as the gifts and graces for ministry that God has given all people, the loss of members due to this position (including many of the younger generation), the closeting of gay and lesbian pastors who are already in our system, the draining of the energy of bishops who disagree with the paragraph and are required to live in a way that is contrary to their convictions, the conflict between upholding the Book of Discipline and caring for effective gay or lesbian pastors, the call for greater flexibility from some seminary leaders, and the stress it places upon gay and lesbian pastors who feel called to seek ministry in the UMC but have to choose between leaving, staying and praying or challenging the BOD and accepting punitive actions.

My response?

1) Thanksgiving for freedom of speech.

I am grateful that the United Methodist Church practices tolerance and allows all parts of the body, be they bishops, pastors or church members, to state the official beliefs of the church and then they are free to give their opinion and share their convictions. We are a people of Holy Conferencing and dialog. God’s revelation is ongoing and it happens best through civil conversations, prayer and the expression of differences of opinion. Think about the early church when Gentiles were first “allowed” to be Christians or when our annual conferences became desegregated or when women were first ordained. In each case a change was happening as people listened to each other, prayed and discerned.
Some of our social issues, though already enacted into church law, are still in the process of debate. Since I became a bishop I have not had an appointment season yet that I haven’t heard from a church informing me that “you can’t send us a woman pastor.” We continue to have conversation and work together. But we work with each other in love and gentleness. The issue of homosexuality is an important dialog for the church in the 21st century. There would not be so much energy and polarization if it were not vitally necessary not only for to the church but for our souls as well. Social justice concerns are never easy as people of good will stand on both sides on this issue. Nonetheless, I believe we need to be in this dialog.

2) ”Compatibility Mode” sentences.

The Social Principles which state that the UMC does not condone the practice of homosexuality and consider this practice incompatible with Christian teaching also states: “all persons are individuals of sacred worth, created in the image of God.” It goes on to say “We affirm that God’s grace is available to all. We will seek to live together in Christian community, welcoming, forgiving, and loving one another, as Christ has loved and accepted us. We implore families and churches not to reject or condemn lesbian and gay members and friends. We commit ourselves to be in ministry for and with all persons.” (Paragraph 161f).
On my computer I have several versions of Microsoft Word. When I send files out on a newer version I hear back from people with computers using different operating systems who say they cannot open my attachments. I send it again in “Compatibility Mode” and it can be read by everyone, no matter what kind of computer they have. I consider the statements I just quoted about welcoming, forgiving, loving and not to reject or condemn are our United Methodist “Compatibility Mode” rules for living. Can we try that? Is God glorified when we go to General Conference and groups from opposing views stand on either side of the street protesting against the other? Aren’t Christians supposed to be the models for the world on how to get along with each other? It is easy to pick a side and say “my side is right and your side is wrong.” Instead let’s do the hard work of compatibility and peacemaking.

3) Truth embraces the whole.

Homosexuality and the church is a difficult issue because each “side” of this debate has a piece of the truth that the other needs. It is not “either/or” but “both/and.” The scriptures are full of these polarities of truth: faith and works, grace and law, predestination and free will, “today you will be with me in Paradise” and “on the last day the dead in Christ shall rise first.” Holiness and hospitality don’t have to be in conflict with one another. In the amazing world of God’s truth they complement one another. Paul reminds us “the eye cannot say to the hand ‘I don’t need you.” (I Corinthians 12: 21a) My prayer is that we stop “othering” the side we don’t agree with out of love for Christ and out of a deep desire for the full truth. May we humbly acknowledge that this “other” side has something to offer us personally in our spiritual walk with the Lord and seek to dialog about it.

I like the 3rd verse of that great hymn of the church “The Church’s One Foundation.” It states “though with a scornful wonder we see her sore oppressed by schisms rent asunder, by heresies distressed, yet saints their watch are keeping, their cry goes up, ‘How long?’ And soon the night of weeping shall be the morn of song.” (BOH 545) May we sing on that morning when the heresy of “my side is the only way” ends and schisms give way to true Christian unity.

4) Keep the main thing the main thing.

The ‘main thing” of course, is “making disciples for Jesus Christ for the transformation of the world.” We need to agree on a main purpose for our church and seek unity that allows us to do this in the most effective way. The practice of constant fighting one another destroys our witness and slows down the central mission. Reaching all people for Christ is the goal, not just some people, not just the ones we agree with, who look like us, act like us, and live like us.

John Wesley, the founder of the Methodist Movement, had such a spirit. According to the Oxford Diaries he came to the aid of a prisoner by the name of Thomas Blair who was charged with a homosexual offence. Out of Wesley’s concern for the eternal soul of this man, he ministered to him spiritually and proactively. He read to him, contacted his attorney, and did some legal writing. This ministry drew a good bit of criticism from the church but Wesley continued to help Blair anyway because of his passion for the gospel and for social justice. When the gospel is the main goal we preach and teach the gospel and we don’t need to choose who is deserving or worthy of our ministry. God will sort it all out.

5) Call to confession and prayer.

Ask God to call to mind the times when we have harmed a brother or a sister by our judgmental words and deeds. I remember being told by a well-meaning and concerned Christian that I was an “abomination” because I was a woman pastor. I understood his theology and his interpretation of scripture but it hurt anyway. I can think of times when I have judged those who disagree with my position on a particular issue and I ask God to forgive me. God is the judge, not us, and when we judge others we stand in line to be judged by a God who sees all. Pray for illumination on this issue and seek guidance on how God wants you to personally respond as we prepare for another General Conference in 2012. Pray with thanksgiving for the gifts that all parts of the Body of Christ bring to the table. Don’t pray that this struggle goes away. Pray that the struggle will bring us to a better day of inclusiveness and understanding for all.

32 comments:

  1. Who do we blame for all those millions of" mistakes"? GOD certainly didn't do it!
    #06330

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  2. Bishop Johnson,
    Thank you.
    We need to learn to listen to others, even those with whom we may disagree. And then speak the 'truth' in an 'agape' kind of love.

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  3. I appreciate your blog and the need to walk gently on this issue, but its time to simply say the issue is over. The church needs to accept our homosexual brother and sisters and not tie them to a 2,000.It is time to accept and allow them to work out their own salvation with fear and trembling.
    Tom Haugh

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  4. I am proud to serve as a United Methodist Pastor in the Eastern Pennsylvania Conference because we have such a wise and loving Bishop who sees the world with the eyes of Christ, hears the cries of those who cry out, and speaks for those who have no voice. Let's strive for Compatibility, but move toward a full system update. Peace and Grace, Pastor Bob "Cherry Lane, Tannersville"

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  5. Thank you for sharing your wisdom on this issue. You have clearly articulated many of my own thoughts on this difficult issue, and I pray our denomination will heed your call for respectful, inclusive discorse when we gather for General Conferance. I hope we can allow all voices to be heard, and can work to find the maximum amount of common ground shared by all of us, especially in regard to what ought to be the priorities and essentials of our faith.
    Respectfully, Rev. Bern Kefer, Senior Pastor, Calvary UMC, Mohnton PA

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  6. Thank you, Bishop Johnson, for this blog. Speaking as a Christian homosexual who is striving for cohesion between my faith and my love for another Christian, this topic is incredibly important to me and has become a leading cause of my life. I've spent many years praying and researching about how to reconcile my beliefs with my homosexuality in hopes of retaining homosexuals as followers of Christ rather than seeing them chased away. I know I can't contain God in my box of understanding on this topic, but I know He knows my heart, and He knows my love is genuine. Thank you for commenting on such a controversial topic, and please know it means so much to so many who don't want to choose between their church and their loved one.

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  7. May we not be judgmental in our behaviors and words. And may we use godly judgement in discerning God's will in this and all decisionmaking.

    And may we be guided in God's will through God's clearest revelation, God's own Holy Word. Not by our own simple emotions or the popular social more's of our own local geography.

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  8. "Let my people go" also includes gay Christians !

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  9. Dear Bishop,

    Thank you so much for calling us back to the table of holy conferencing and dialogue. Thank you for reminding us that it is in our ability to work together in the midst of our differences that we exalt the best quality as children of God - Love.
    Finally, thank you for your sensitivity and empathy to all those who feel called to ministry or have a loved one in their family that is struggling to remain a part of this church. Your call to prayer also reminded me of the one sacrament that settles all arguments and causes no division among us, it is the call to the Lord's table, where all are welcome and no one goes away hungry!
    My prayers are with you as you lead us forward!

    Peace
    Rev. Lydia Munoz
    PlumbLine Fellowship

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  10. like your thoughts and comments very much Bishop Johnson. I too agree that it's time we stop arguing and fighting about this issue and engage in fruitful and worthwhile dialogues. It makes me sad when I meet new deacons and elders at Conference and then in a year or two they are gone and pursuing graduate degrees at other Universities. Not necessarily because they have defined themselves as being
    GLBTQ but because they cannot ethically and morally be a part of an institution that divides its members. I very much look forward to future discussions on this very important topic!!!
    Barbara Revere

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  11. Dear Bishop Johnson, Thank you for being a voice for unity in the church. What I love about Methodism is that we are to live out the clame we are a church with open minds, open hearts and open doors. But it seems like for some the closet doors are locked. Sometimes "transforming the world" means transforming ourselves.

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  12. Thank you Bishop for beginning this important dialogue in our conference and saying it in a way that people on all sides feel valued and heard. I am blessed to be part of a United Methodist Church that has struggled to be open with this topic and to make sure everyone knows that our doors are open to all, and truly mean all. I believe God has created us each in a special way, loves us each just as we are, absolutely regardless of sexual preference. I support a change so that homosexuality is not referred to in any way as incompatible with Christianity and an obstacle to being ordained. I hope many will respond to your column and we can do so with respect and caring. Thank you for this forum.
    Deede C.

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  13. Thank you for leadership and your pastoral care to all of God's people.

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  14. I want to applaud Bishop Johnson as I can hear how she is torn in her deep concern that this issue has for our church. I want to also add that we need to be careful how we use the word “inclusive” because for many with an agenda, it has only one meaning and that is “to include only those who think like I do.” When we as pastors stop and think we can afford to exclude no one, no matter their views or stance or orientation.
    I have been privileged to serve churches that have had homosexual members who were very well accepted as Christ would ask them to be. They were looked upon as persons of sacred worth. I do want to add, however that when serving one appointment that a conversation came up at Bible study on the subject of welcoming the homosexual in the congregation. A couple were opposed, but then realized that we are all sinners as well. But then someone asked, suppose a person who just got out of jail came to our church, would they be welcomed or included. I am reminded of the story of the Prodigal Son in Luke 15:11-14 and would we be the ones who would be angry that a person who served jail time was also welcomed in our church, after all we are looking at being “inclusive.” How many of us as pastors would have the guts if a person was released from jail for embezzlement and wanted to be our treasurer to let this person in our midst? Would we trust them after their debt to society was paid? Are we not the ones called to not condemn and welcome? Let’s take this one a bit closer to home. Would we include a convicted child molester in our youth programs after their debt to society was paid? Or if you now are saying “no” are you saying the Blood of Christ does NOT have the power to cleanse sins?
    I believe that before we use a catch word like “inclusive” that we need to ask are we truly willing to “forgive us as we forgive those….” Or are we just saying “inclusive” and not thinking of all of its ramifications. Please, take these words to heart, I have watched as the word, “inclusive” has begun tearing the fabric of the Episcopal/Anglican church apart. When we use the word to say, “because you believe this way, you belong in this group” or “You hold this principle and thus hate your brother or sister” the word “inclusive” becomes another byword for “prejudice.”

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  15. In both the Old Testament and New Testament, homosexual acts are condemned. So now the UMC is now saying that the Word of God is no longer valid by wanting to allow homosexuals to teach, minister, and be ordained. We should not allow immoral social values to dictate to the church how the Word of God is to be twisted. Does the false prophet in Revelations mean anything to the United Methodist Church? I can not see how we would allow people to turn their back on God's Holy Word by allowing social misdirection to sway our long established values set by the Word of Our Holy Father. I am totally against homosexuals teaching in the church, they have already pushed thier twisted agenda to far in this country which at one time was a God fearing country.

    I am ashamed that the United Methodist Church is even considering giving into the evil one just for the sake of numbers in the pews. A lot of the loss is not because allowing homosexual to teach. However, some pastors that believe that the church they lead is their own kingdom,(I personnally know three)and older members not allowing the younger members to help in the church. Or all the sports programs and stores being open during worship services.

    Homosexuals is not the answer to fill the pews. The answer is getting the morality back into this country, we as a people have bent so far to accomodate others agenda. We have shot our selves and have lost so much ground in Christianity that we need to get back to the Word of God and not accomodate people that throw that same Word back in God's face.

    David Charles Church

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  16. Thank you for your arguments for being "compatible" in Christ. As a mother of a child who is homosexual, I have wrestled with similar arguments, and my child has felt that God's saving grace could not be "his" because of how the "Christian" community views him. May God bless you and the other bishops and your quest for embracing everyone for God.

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  17. Yes, we do need to be about the central point of our faith: inviting people to follow Christ, admit they are people being destroyed by evil, but recognizing that Jesus provided the way out through His death and resurrection. There are verses often quoted that state that homosexual acts are not to be done. As believers, we are to uphold the teaching of Scripture, whether we like it or understand it or not. Should the church be ministering to homosexuals? In the same way that we minister to all sinners - offering the love and forgiveness of Jesus. Should homosexuals be welcome in our church services? Of course, the same as any person. Should they be permitted to become a member? If they, like the rest of us sinners, admit they are sinners, ask forgiveness and repent (change their life style) then they should be welcome as members, just like the rest of us, whatever our former life style or sins may have been. As members are they automatically acceptable for leadership positions? No more or no less than any other member. Standards for such are laid out in various verses in the New Testament. Our goal is not to make everyone feel loved, affirmed and comfortable. Our goal is to teach the message of Jesus, to encourage people to live His way, and to express these teachings with a loving attitude. Having proclaimed His message and upheld His standards, "let the chips fall where they may" - and sometimes that is not comfortable.

    Marty Hunsberger
    Covenant UMC, Moore Twp

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  18. Dear Bishop, Thanks you for your thoughtful comments. As a United Methodist elder serving churches in good standing for over 20 years, I am glad that I have been allowed to do this despite being a woman and being divorced. I hope for the day when openly gay and lesbian pastors can serve United Methodist Churches. Sincerely, Reverend Debra Stanton

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  19. Jesus loved all and loved the sinners. We can love the homosexual as Jesus commands us... But if we believe in the Bible as God's Word and are disciples of Jesus Christ then are we not bound by 1 Corinthians 6 V 9-20??

    9. Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders
    10. nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.
    11. And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.
    12. "Everything is permissible for me"--but not everything is beneficial. "Everything is permissible for me"--but I will not be mastered by anything.
    13. "Food for the stomach and the stomach for food"--but God will destroy them both. The body is not meant for sexual immorality, but for the Lord, and the Lord for the body.
    14. By his power God raised the Lord from the dead, and he will raise us also.
    15. Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ himself? Shall I then take the members of Christ and unite them with a prostitute? Never!
    16. Do you not know that he who unites himself with a prostitute is one with her in body? For it is said, "The two will become one flesh."
    17. But he who unites himself with the Lord is one with him in spirit.
    18. Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a man commits are outside his body, but he who sins sexually sins against his own body.
    19. Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own;
    20. you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your body.

    We are commanded to love one another. But are we to condone the sin of practicing Homosexuality? They belong in our church to be fed on God's Word but do we want practicing homosexuals to teach God's Word to His people? to His Children? Tolerance can only go so far.... before it breaks God's Word. This country is being asked to tolerate a lot... And Jesus did not tolerate what was against His Father! And we should not either!

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  20. Jesus loved all and loved the sinners. We can love the homosexual as Jesus commands us... But if we believe in the Bible as God's Word and are disciples of Jesus Christ then are we not bound by 1 Corinthians 6 V 9-20??

    9. Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders
    10. nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.
    11. And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.
    12. "Everything is permissible for me"--but not everything is beneficial. "Everything is permissible for me"--but I will not be mastered by anything.
    13. "Food for the stomach and the stomach for food"--but God will destroy them both. The body is not meant for sexual immorality, but for the Lord, and the Lord for the body.
    14. By his power God raised the Lord from the dead, and he will raise us also.
    15. Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ himself? Shall I then take the members of Christ and unite them with a prostitute? Never!
    16. Do you not know that he who unites himself with a prostitute is one with her in body? For it is said, "The two will become one flesh."
    17. But he who unites himself with the Lord is one with him in spirit.
    18. Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a man commits are outside his body, but he who sins sexually sins against his own body.
    19. Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own;
    20. you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your body.

    We are commanded to love one another. But are we to condone the sin of practicing Homosexuality? They belong in our church to be fed on God's Word but do we want practicing homosexuals to teach God's Word to His people? to His Children? Tolerance can only go so far.... before it breaks God's Word. This country is being asked to tolerate a lot... And Jesus did not tolerate what was against His Father! And we should not either!

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  21. Thank you Bishop Johnson for your thoughtful and loving response to the Bishop's Statement. May we be the body of Christ in this world remembering that Jesus chose to hang out with and show love to those who were easily despised by others. The word's of the old hymn ring true, "and they'll know we are Christians by our love."
    Pastor Eva Johnson

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  22. As soon as somebody point out where in the Bible it says that God created Adam and Eve AND Steve, I will reconsider my position on the issue.
    If I am wrong about it, please accept my apologies.
    God Bless.
    Miguel

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  23. Thank you Bishop, it is good to hear your thoughts. You words reminded me that in order to effect change we have to be willing to stay at the table. If we think about the disciples, they were from very different places in life. Yet, they stayed at the table to discuss their differences.

    Blessings and grace,

    Rev. Marie Smith
    Stillwater UMC- Miller Lane Dayton Ohio

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  24. Dear Mrs. Johnson,

    I am somewhat concerned about you.

    You should repent immediately. God can stand when a believer sins sometimes, but when someone teaches wrong he will be damned surely (anathema).

    I am somewhat busy with the theology of Bonhoeffer and Luther and have learnt to handle the bible according to their way and manner.

    In his Epistle to the Romans Chapter 1 St. Paul tells us plainly and clearly that homosexuality is a very bad sin.

    Of course God wants to help all people and also a gay can repent, believe in Christ and be baptized in Jesus name so that his sins will be forgiven and he will be set free. After baptism his life will improve surely. In case of already experienced infant batism a second baptism is not allowed. The new believer can refer back to his infant baptism. Jesus acts during baptism: the old man dies and a New Life comes down from heaven.

    To sum it up: A gay should not become a pastor but a believer.
    Every believer can become a pastor if he has a gift from above.

    Kind regards,
    Rainer Braendlein (Munich/Germany)
    website: http://www.confessingchurch.wordpress.com)

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  25. It is such a blessing to have such a wise bishop! Although I am eager for the day when persons of all orientations can freely walk into all United Methodist Churches and also serve in all capacities, I understand that this jump is difficult for many folks. Bishop Peggy Johnson has called us all to ACT like the Christians . . . and the United Methodists that we are and let God do the judging. We are just to Love God & Love one another as Jesus told when asked what is the greatest commandment.

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  26. Great blog. I agree whole-heartedly with the quote in the beginning of your blog. Homosexuals should not serve in a leadership role in the church. I base that statement not on the BOOK OF DISCIPLINE, but on the word of God, where he beautifully created and ordained marriage as between one man and one woman. Paul also addressed homosexuality in his letter to the Corinthians when he was telling them how they should live their lives as part of the body of Christ. We are called to be set apart from the world and to deny the desires of the flesh.

    Having said that, I believe the Church (religion) has done the world a major disservice and has alot of blood on its hands. We do what we can to tear down someone different from us and then tell them they need to be just like us. Our job is to love the unsaved and accept them where they are. We can not judge them. They are sinners who are lost and need Jesus, not Christianity. Jesus, not religion. Jesus is who transforms us into the likeness of Him. My prayer is that we, the Church, wake up and see that Jesus is the way, love the sinner and not the sin, and let the Holy Spirit transform all of us sinners into the likeness of Jesus.

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  27. Great response Bishop. Thanks for your thoughts, encouragment and grace. Duane Anders

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  28. Bishop - I don't think you can compare female pastors to homosexual pastors. The bible does not state that being a woman is an abomination to God. It does however state that homosexuality is an abomination to God.

    Ministering to practicing homosexuals is vastly different from allowing practicing homosexuals to become leaders in our churches that "claim" to follow Jesus Christ. Everyone regardless of their lifestyle deserves to have the Gospel shared with them...to have needs met...to be loved...and to also know the inerrant truth of the Holy Scripture. We have no problem with telling a rapist that what they do is wrong in the eyes of God, but we are terrified to tell the truth to homosexuals.

    I am unwilling to be tolerant of sin. Homosexuality is sin. The bible does not tell us we need to be tolerant of sin...in fact it tells us the opposite. Jesus himself says that he did not come to bring peace, but to bring division. There is no peace in tolerance of sin. The only thing that comes out of sin tolerance is the expansion of the kingdom of satan that is allowed by us...when we are suposed to be trampling the kingdom of satan under our feet!

    If the UMC decides to allow practicing confessing homosexuals to be in leadership, my family and I will leave the UMC and not look back.


    Dane Rada - Kent Island United Methodist Church.

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  29. I pray we can keep homosexuality and the christian in conversation and prayer. So many have so much to offer. We need to work harder to dispel the perception that the "church is a bunch of hypocrits" and display the light of Christ in all we do, say and believe, even when it beyond our comfort zone.

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  30. Addressing homosexuality and the Church has two sides: One side will have open arms, the other side closed fists. Where should the Church stand on this topic? Scripture teaches us that men who have sex with men will not inherit the kingdom of God (1 Corinthians 6:9-10). This does not mean that a homosexual is forbidden entry because of his label; it implies that the act which he commits prevents the entry. The Church is the “called out ones” who follow the teachings of Christ. Jesus commanded us to love one another.

    At times, that love will appear uncomfortable and demanding. If love is based on truth, it will accomplish its goal of improving an individual and the community. Yes, love can be gentle, too. Christians should approach each individual as an individual. What works for one person may not work for another.

    To equate women’s suffrage or segregation of blacks is not he the same as dealing with the topic of homosexuality. These topics were born out of the desire to have power over others. Being a woman or having a dark pigment of the skin is not addressed as sinful in the Bible. Both issues were resolved through the uprising of these groups, showing others the truth about these discriminations. I cannot tell if someone is homosexual like I can if they are African-American or a woman. If someone is gay, they have to let me know. And, by advising me of their preference, they implicitly admit to an intimate relationship.

    Gay people don’t believe their lifestyle is wrong. It is their preference to have a relationship between loving people of the same sex. But where is the measuring rod for determining the right or wrong of something? Adulterers don’t believe their act is wrong. Should we allow anyone to lead a congregation of Christian people? Do we not have qualifications and guidelines to follow? As Christians, we look to Scripture for the “canon” or measuring rod.

    Social justice is an equally important topic. From a Christian perspective, it addresses equality in human rights. From a political perspective, social justice would have everyone equal in social and economic areas. If, as the political definition desires, everyone is equal, then we lose our liberty, for liberty cannot exist where there is full equality. People need the liberty to choose who they desire to be. We do not need some mandate telling us that we have to be like others. There will always be poor and wealthy, sick and well, and lazy and active among us.

    Our desire as Christians is to be the light of the world, shining in the darkness of sin. Only when one sees this light and makes a choice to accept it will he begin the journey to everlasting life. At times, this demands the kind of love that corrects and admonishes.

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  31. This is one of many reasons why I left the methodist church. If it was an abomination in the "old" testament, or TaNaKh, it is still an abomination today. The God I worship is a unchanging God. Lets look at a few passages if we may:

    Leviticus 20:13(KJV)
    If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

    What did Paul have to say about the "issue"?
    1 Corinthians 6:9-10 (NASB)
    9Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,
    10nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.

    So should we condone it?
    1 Corinthians 6:18 (NASB)Flee immorality. Every other sin that a man commits is outside the body, but the immoral man sins against his own body.

    Now, perhaps I have taken it out of context, but perhaps you, Bishop, could point me to passage where God suddenly changed his mind and said its fine to practice homosexuality.

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  32. If we UMCers are people of "Open hearts, Open minds, Open doors", then the UM church would also welcome ministries that work with those who want to be free from same-sex attractions Why do the 'open doors' only swing one way? Does the UM church offer the tranforming power of Jesus Christ for those wanting freedom from the struggle with same-sex attractions? Sounds like "Closed doors" to me.

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